New Chaos vehicle suggestions and discussion

[WH00T]

That CUT Dropship sounds like a cool idea. Balance would be an issue, but that could easily be countered by having the ship require more people to pilot and/or use the onboard weapons. However, I do think that mabey instead of a proxy launcher it should have bombs. like those big h-bombs that just drop out of the bottom of planes and fall straight down. oh, and the cables should be able to pick up enemy vehicles too. Oh, and I think it should be faster than anyone on foot, but big enough that it could be hit at full speed by Helen Keller. No offence meant to the disabled. oh, and it should have a windshield so you can snipe the pilot(s) and the turrets should be open to sniper fire too. and when it crashes, or falls for lack of a pilot to keep it up, it should take MASSIVE damage. A freefall from lack of a pilot should destroy the whole thing unless it was cruising at low altitude. The level designer should have control over what vehicles start inside of it, too, for ultimate balance. Ooh, and if it was still to strong, you could put on a side door so you could grapple on and kill everyone from the inside. I don't reall think it would be practical to use the mesh that comes with ut2003/4, because you'd have to totally redesign it anyway to give it an interior, docking bays and turrets.

[-Penfold-]

I don't reall think it would be practical to use the mesh that comes with ut2003/4, because you'd have to totally redesign it anyway to give it an interior, docking bays and turrets.

oh, for Pete's sake.

I wasn't arguing for the use of the existing UT04 dropship mesh to be used with the carrier pepito mentions. I was merely saying that hypothetically, it could be used if need be for something like a beta or alpha test.

Though I like the idea about it dropping a bomb instead of proxies. Proxies are very cool and all, but I think they shouldn't become too common, or they'll lose some apeal. Like a great song that's overplayed on the radio. It doesn't make the song bad, but you might get tired of listening to it.

A very damaging bomb with a very small damage radius that truly free falls with any forward or sideways momentum of the ship included would be very cool. As you practically need a direct hit, you wouldn't have to restrict the rate of fire too much, and as it would be very damaging, a hit would be oh so rewarding. Perhaps give it a damaging blast that travels up and not out, so that low altitude easy hits become dangerous to the carrier, or just disable bombing when below a certain distance from the ground/solid/vehicle immediately below.

Good idea, WH00T!

[Zachariah]

once again penfold , we're completely capable of doing our own vehicle models and not at liberty to take others , even epics.

nothing against the idea , just the theft of model.

Anyway, I have a couple questions.

1) Does the gunship just carry players or also other vehicles? I'm not sure if you mentioned the room for vehicles as a unit of measure or as an actual function of vehicle carrying use.

2) If it's used to carry vehicles, why would it be worth the hassle of docking if the vehicles might be faster than it?

3) If it's not used to carry vehicles, do you or the team have any plans for a fast flying vehicle that could? For balance's sake, such a vehicle would probably need limited armament.

4) As the Avril is clearly a powerful anti-vehicle missile as a way to add some balance to the player without a vehicle against a player with a vehicle, wouldn't a vehicle that could have multiple Avrils shot from it be too powerful an anti-vehicle vehicle? The missile was made under the assumption that something with a small amount of hitpoints would be fireing it and now something with an extreme amount of hitpoints could fire several simultaniously. Granted, the more people you have in it, the less you have elsewhere, but it seems it might be too effective and therefore off balance against other vehicles, perhaps all other vehicles, especially the raptor.

5) Will the people walking around inside the vehicle know the vehicles hitpoints? Will those in turrets?

6) Will the vehicles destruction also destroy every inhabitant? Will the opponent that destroyed the vehicle get credit all the frags resulting, even those that are walking inside the vehicle and not docked at a turret?

Please, don't take my questions as insultive. You seem to take offense to 1/4th of what I say. I'm just curious. If I didn't like your mod and the work that lead to it, I wouldn't bother making suggestions and asking curious questions.

im sorry I came across as seeming insultive . I honestly have no grudge against you. Neolith brilliantlly stated without sounding offensive what I couldnt quite capture. I have no grudge against you , its just that I do get somewhat angered when people suggest that we use premade models , or scale up playermodels. Trust me , if someone else were suggesting those things , I'd get on their case too. I have no ill will towards you , just the fact that you continue to mention the use of other peoples models and / or shortcuts. Believe me when I say that we dont go for an idea because its simple to do , if we like an Idea well enough , we'll go well out of our way to get it done. either way , Its not that big of a deal , so I'll leave it be for now. I'm very sorry that I made you feel unwelcome. in fact , I like you somewhat , because , even though I may not agree with all the aspects of your ideas , fundamentally , they are usually good ones.

anyway , the questions you asked about the gunship. First I'd like to point out that no vehicles have been finalized , and the gunship is just a suggestion like everyone elses suggestions.

but seeing as how it was my idea , I'll take the liberty of answering htose questions

1.the gunship is supposed to carry players And vehicles, as I mentioned , it would have a large door on the rear that the pilot could lower and raise to create an entrance path for another player to drive their vehicles into. Players could ride it by manning the turrets , or simply standing in/on it .

2.one thing , is that i originally intended for hte gunship to have an opening on either side about one scorpion wide that went out onto a platform which held both an open area for players to shoot from , and a smaller side section where a Turret was located.You make agood point that a carrier should be fast. but in this case there are some advantages. one of the advantages of carrying a vehicle , is that when teh ship is going down , the players could drive the vehicle out as an escape means , to avoid fall damage. also , the Vehicles on land might out run the Gunship , but dont forget that the gunship can fly over obstacles that the vehicle would have trouble with , and cut clear across the map. when I mean slow I dont mean horribly slow. I mean marginally faster than a tank , but not as fast as a manta or raptor.

3.it is used for transporting vehicles. but making it has not even been discussed. Im just throwing it out so that when we get time , we can come back and say , hey what about this idea.
however even if my vehicle isnt used , I have very little doubt that the team would pass up the chance to make a vehicle mover.

4. the Vehicle is Definately powerful when put into those terms , but , like the turrets, its only overpowered the first time. once its been established that there is a clear threat in the sky to vehicles , players will use their common sense to take down the Gunship. It would pretty easy to keep a lock on it , given its speed. and remember , there may be a bunch of people on the gunship , but if the teams are balanced , the other team has just as many people , and with coordination , could take down the gunship with little stress , thus providing a rewarding kill. the people on the gunship may have firepower , but at the same time , theyre not taking nodes , and theyre a very big target. I also would like to reduce the original hit points of the vehicle from 8 avrils worth to 4 , cause I didnt take into consideration the fact that people could stand inside and heal it (although they will eventually run out of ammo.)

5.the people walking inside the vehicle would not have a direct display of the hitpoints . but as the vehicle took damage , it could start sparking inside , followed by smoke , and eventually fire. and of course , theres always that green health bar that appears on/over vehicles . People in turrets however , would definately have a numerical display of the vehicles health.

6. Not sure , havent really thought about that one

but those are all good questions and I dont take them as insultive , cause they made me rethink the vehicle.


also , One thing i was considering , was taking an existing ons map. replacing the Core with a Transmitting dish node , and making the Gunship A core.then removing its weapons , or limiting them. placing player spawnpoints on board , and possibly even a vehicle spawnpoint. of course , this gunship would be somewhat larger than my first description , and behave a bit differently . . .

[EDIT] The weapons could be limited by only activating them when the core gunship is vulnerable. at other times , its invulnerable , but cant fire its weapons ( people can still shoot off of it , but they can only spawn on it if it remains a certain distance from an enemy node. when youre too close to that node , a visual message will be displayed on the map and to the pilot.)

[-Penfold-]

Anyway, I have a couple questions. [...]

I'm sorry, but I have a single answer for all your questions only:

We haven't yet decided if we are going to do new vehicles nor what kind of vehicles. We are just collecting ideas and playing UT2004 to tryt to get a feeling on how all the new things (including vehicles) interact with one another and what we could do without disrupting the balance given by EPIC. After all, we want to add to the game, not to create something just for the sake of doing it.

Why, that wasn't an answer to all of my questions, that was an answer to a question that I did not ask and certainly an answer I could've done without knowing.

Speaking of not knowing, the information you gave that for some reason I cannot recollect is thrilling news. Lucky I don't know about it, or I would be even more impatient for the next release!

Thanks for the post.

[Zachariah]

Why, that wasn't an answer to all of my questions,

I answered your questions.

[-Penfold-]

Ah, yes, but I hadn't read it as I was typing out my response.

And, yes, you thorougly answered my questions. Thank you.

[Shadowstar]

I personally would like to design an Invasion map where all of the players are onboard a gigantic, player-flyable airship, which has some fighters docked, and then have a BSP-based alien ship where monsters can spawn and attack the player ship. The player ship should be indestructable, but the pilot and all the players onboard are attackable. If the pilot dies, the vehicle stops moving, but doesn't die or anything.

This would be a very unique concept and should make for a very interesting invasion map, or could even possibly be adapted to vCTF.

Of course, this would require a vehicle large enough to act as an entire level (or most of it anyway). So I don't know how feasible it is, but it truly would be interesting to try.

[Isotope]

Another idea for a vehicle! ooh, ooh!

Something between the size and speed of the hellbender and the scorpian. 2 players... It'd be like a light attack craft, and have a chaingun turret on the top rear, with the user exposed. The chaingun would shoot bullets half as damaging as sniper rounds, but would be incredibly inaccurate. The driver's primary fire could be a short-range flashing device, to blind infantry ahead of it. Secondary fire would fire retro-jets, for quick stops and reversals.


Or... A light tank that has two erdw's. Erdws would have the same secondary fire, and would still fire slower that way...

[Deapblade]

Hey -Penfold-, no offense but please don't double post and use the edit button.

Saw you a couple of thimes double posting so...

EDIT: Im not gonna cry about it, I just thought you didn't know that rule because you double posted a couple of things.

[-Penfold-]

Where?

One I double posted because I'd decided to respond to one after I'd posted already, and as the first one was entirely directed at one person and the next at another, I figured it wouldn't be too big of a crime. I'll try to avoid it more, sorry.

[ChaosJester]

Just a thought.. How about a horse or some creature as a "vehicle"? If you trying for medieval, animals would be the way to go.. plus it would make a larger map possible. High Tech vehicles wouldn't go with the idea.

Also for more stuff you could add a wagon and other variants to be like the Leviathan and the other vehicles.

[Shadowstar]

It's been considered, but we haven't made any decisions on it yet.

[TKATK]

i dont think a creature would be nice....the should have ai then and would you like your horse throw you off and run away as soon as its hit?

[Melekai]

hmm,, as far as creatures goes, horses wolves and dragons.. dafinatly big batlike dragons! ..

HAHA ... anyone remeber DINORIDERS? lol!--- that would be something eh? LOL!

I' still love the design and control of the halo vehicles. woulda loved the control of the the vehiclles as an option, AND the actual vehicle models themselves.

The hoverboard is awesome idea.. Love it to bits!. some hoverbikes racerbiikes would be nice.
(and some ai that makes NPC's use them more. )

and on some jeeps or something it would be sweet if you put in that grapple.. for instance to grapple a car or something outta water. or acid. or whatever.
and that dual grapple idea? has that been discussed again lately?. one end ina wall the other ina vehicle.. poor enemy cant leave

also, the ninja rope mod had some awesome stuff for the grapple which made it seem more ropey. wonder if you guys could maybe work that code in?.

this mod is becoming a real everything mod

[Zachariah]

I' still love the design and control of the halo vehicles. woulda loved the control of the the vehiclles as an option, AND the actual vehicle models themselves.

well that right there is a no-no. We're against using/borrowing ideas from other games/movies/television/literature/any other forms of media for various reasons.