Chaotic Dreams

I know alot of work has been done on PR2 in all area's but I have to say I'm still just testing the melee combat as it's the single feature I've most been waiting for.

I've noticed a few things though and I'm not sure if some of it is just lucky or if I'm doing something that I just can't seem to reproduce at will.

sometimes when I swing a weapon it seems to have a glow and trail effect, and when I connect with one of those swings it does more damage (or at least appears to). Is this a special move? is there something you have to do in order to get that effect everytime? or is it supposed to be there for all swings and my computer just isn't always displaying it?

also I've noticed that there are some unique animations which would appear to be a specialized move, some weapons have it, and some don't, at least that I've been able to find so far. if there are special moves for each weapon or stance, would it be possible to get a list of them, or instructions on how to do them? I think it would make for a much better match, since most of the swings even for the different stances are pretty basic and lack a certain amount of flare.

in short (for those who don't want to read all that):

1. is there a type of swing that is more powerful and has a sort of glowing animation around the blade? and if so, how is it accomplished?

2. is there more than one special move, does each stance have one? and if so, could they be listed here to help make melee combat more exciting?

there is a slight glow on the blades whenever you swing, but faster swings leave a longer and more noticable trail. The only way besides headshotting or changing weapons to actually increase damage is to switch to a heavier stance and get a small damage bonus.

As for special moves... there are not really any per se... but the katana and daggers have spins for instance, and a few others have some more unique animations.

Also the more your blade/weapon is in contact with the player the more damage it does. So if you just nick them, you will not do that much of damage. But if you blade swings all the way through them, then you do mega damage!

I've found the spins for the katana and daggers, but the only time I get them to work is in midair and so far I can't time it to get a hit with one of these attacks, but I'm still working on that

I've tried all the swords and the axe, although I haven't played with the hammer at all, (I'm partial to blades )

I've had some fun with the attacks while spinning and flipping, although the timing on those is pretty hard to get right, especially against a moving player.

I definately hope to see the animations and moves of Melee combat expanded in future releases. There's alot to figure out already, but I think it could only get better, especially with the addition of special moves for each weapon, or even each weapon and each stance.

One thing I might suggest (if possible) is making the forward lunges and stabs hit more directly in front of the player, as of now it appears to lunge off to the right, which is an unnatural menouver and looks slightly odd to me whenever I see the animation.

I'd also love to see some upward swings from the crouching postion, to give a fighter a chance to duck under an incoming attack and strike upwards at an airborn opponent.

all in all though I'm loving the new combat system, I've always been fond of one on one duels, with melee weapons. I bladed in HereticII for several years, and also did saber battles in JKII so I've been looking forward to this mod for quite a while.

great work to the team, and thanks for listening to all of us and doing what you can to improve the mod. I can't wait to see more features for the melee system

How do I summon the melee weapons? I've searched all the INT files I could find and couldn't find anything.

Can they be used in first person mode?

ive played around a bit now.. and im impressed.. it does play well.. although the speed are very slow. the aiming works good.. and im sure youve got a lot of wonderful ideas.. but since ive been thinking about melee systems fora while. i would like to add my lil list of ideas.
*by the way.. i can only do isntant action weapons switches not when im a server against another human player ... i used the update install. *

these ideas may already be in the works, some i have heard some i dont know so im just drawing up my semi dreamy weapoin system.

short list then long list


*for you guys who are actually reading my ideas... and see problems.. id love to see if i could think up a solution to the problem ..
Short
==================
*Combos (with animations)
*Attack strength buttons instead of stances. (Easier to do combos)
*Damage dependant on velocity at time of contact. (no more headshots from holding a inert piece of metal still. or enemy running into you sword wahtever- i think that is what happens at the moment)
*Onscreen view of hitlocations, and movement attack rate penalties for injured parts.
*adrenaline used as stamina?.
*Camera control (check out unwheel)
*matrixmod style dodges with inside view (its fun to be isoriented. just compatibility with it)
*teamstle combat
*armor system.
*get hit animations, (WISHES there was a way to ragdoll someone to the ground, then use arrows keys to roll up left right back etc.. from lyign down possition. )

well there is my dream melee system i think



more explanations of each. if wanted needed.. for fun.. or flaming at my stupidity
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*combinations moves.. not sure the best way to do this. .or if its even possible.. maybe holding down the attack will do something.*
few options.. lenght held down could be speed of attack
the actual damage applied when sword hits. is based
on the intial velocitiy of the attack
length held down just increases attack power. with different states.. if held down long enough it does an next level of strength attack.. (this would not be so good for combo in future)

*more than one attack button.. a lot of mice these days have those extra buttons .perhaps sticking the block button as keyboard shortcut.. and using the left right and middle buttons as actually strength attack buttons.
light medium hard. as on the old consoles or SF2.. (im a big fan of that..).. that might make it easier to build a combo system.
ie seperate stances have optional seperate attack buttons.

*hit locations... karmaed, where you push the ragdoll off the building and you can see which parts of the body are being damaged.. do somethign simular. and use the limp.. you go much slower when you run... if arm is hurt bad you swing slower. if arm or leg critically hurt.. you can not do attack for taht direction. or move if leg... if one leg is left.. you can move in air by jumping .. hop away with one leg.. hehe. a visual way to see what area you attack.. dolls in corners perahps.. showing where and what parts are injured of you and enemy.*

*more camera control options. hold down button to let you move camera around. unwheel has a system whereyou drive the car around and you move your camera with the mouse.. in and out and all around.. as well as a few different modes chasecam etc.. perhaps with their persmiision you could cut some work out of the equation.*

*matrix moves mmm really love that mod.. and would be really neat to be able to have compatibility with it slow mo is hard though... but i dont think there should be any probelms with apocmatrixmoves.. ill try that one.. monkey matrix moves i dont expect to run so well if at all... its very neat to have the camera spin when you do a cartwheel or flip.. i like it *

*visable armor system, differt pickups from places. each pickup will atttach a armor model to a base player model. sorta omre adesginers mod.. and have each one put the part its portecting on god mode or something., till its destroyed on which it makes tha t body part vulnerable again. (one option only there are prolly more ways*

Nemephosis wrote:How do I summon the melee weapons? I've searched all the INT files I could find and couldn't find anything.

Can they be used in first person mode?

Well, it used to be in the UT2003.ini file "bMeleeWeapon=" but I don't see it anymore. If I am correct (don't take my word for this), it was equal to "ChaosUT.BSword" so all you have to type is summon ChaosUT.BSword I think.

is there any way to add these weapons thru use of switcharsenal mutator? to replace the shield gun or assault rifle when you spawn in? I'd love to have a katana or bastard sword to replace my shield gun in normal matches

Thats mean!!!

Just think of all those POOR BOTS!!!

Nemephosis wrote:How do I summon the melee weapons? I've searched all the INT files I could find and couldn't find anything.

Can they be used in first person mode?

At the moment the only other game type they will work proprely is in KoTH or TeamKoTH. We plan to support melees with all ChaosGametypes. Having the standard gametypes support melee is a different issue. Melee requires its only player controller and pawn class. So we run the risk of breaking other mods/gametypes if we just swap out their pawn/contollers with our for Melee.

And right now no. 1st View is on the list but it will take a bit to do properly. The big issue is trying to tie what you see in 1st person to what is happing in the 3rd person view. They will not be the same (like in 3rd you do flips when you double jump, yets in 1st you don't see the world turning during your flip So at this point we don't have a good idea how to tie the two together...

WulfMan wrote:is there any way to add these weapons thru use of switcharsenal mutator? to replace the shield gun or assault rifle when you spawn in? I'd love to have a katana or bastard sword to replace my shield gun in normal matches

Not yet. But its something we wanted to do.

So will we be able to use melee weapons in normal matches some time? Even if I had to play in 3rd person I'd do it. The melee weapons are great.

Yes you will Nemephosis... But as jb said, we don't want to break other mods, so it would be ChaosDM, ChaosInvasion, etc...

jb wrote:

Nemephosis wrote:How do I summon the melee weapons? I've searched all the INT files I could find and couldn't find anything.

Can they be used in first person mode?

At the moment the only other game type they will work proprely is in KoTH or TeamKoTH. We plan to support melees with all ChaosGametypes. Having the standard gametypes support melee is a different issue. Melee requires its only player controller and pawn class. So we run the risk of breaking other mods/gametypes if we just swap out their pawn/contollers with our for Melee.

And right now no. 1st View is on the list but it will take a bit to do properly. The big issue is trying to tie what you see in 1st person to what is happing in the 3rd person view. They will not be the same (like in 3rd you do flips when you double jump, yets in 1st you don't see the world turning during your flip So at this point we don't have a good idea how to tie the two together...

Oh, I asked for that too, and opened another thread, shame on me

But here's my suggestion:

1.) Flips:

Rip off the code from the MonkeyMatrixGuys (nobody tell that I have such evil thoughts, yeah?!). It works pretty good and gives an impressive result.

2.) See in 1st person view what can be seen in 3rd person view:

For 1st person view, just take 3rd person view and decrease the distance from player-cam to player-model to 0 or something really near the model. - As one possibility.

Apart from that we would not mind not seeing the world turn around while flipping 'round, as long as we can crush our enemies in 1st person view

I tried having guns with swords and it doesn't work at all. Even against the bow, they can kill you before you hit them once with your weapon.