Chaotic Dreams

I've an idea for a (relatively) minor (I think), tweak to the way Chaos CTF works that would encourage a bit more teamplay:

First off, make the flag drop button drop them one at a time, starting with your flag if you have it.
Second, make the default winning score 3 'captures'.
Then, alter the way points are scored -
one cap if you deliver both flags simultaneously,
two capture points if you only deliver the enemy flag, whilst yours is in the holder.

Optional extras include: making the return of your own flag worth a few frags, or a medal; only dropping the enemy flag when you grapple/translocate; being able to carry your own flag in any vehicle.

All of the above force teamwork by making it easier to win if your base has been properly defended (they haven't taken your flag) or no-one's been a flag hogger (despite how cool it looks to have crossed flags on your back and a dirty great sword in your fist). Also encourages retrieval scouting, as one of your team zips in and out to retrieve your flag on a hoverboard, in the face of most of the enemy team who want it for the points; the scout can also keep them distracted whilst his team go for the cap . Or, at least, those are the images running through my mind.
Of course it won't be long before some enterprising so-and-so figures out the 'last second handoff' technique, which may need to be discouraged, perhaps by a speed penalty for having both flags.

That's it I think. Thoughts, comments and exuberant adulation all gratefully recieved. If I come up with any more I'll add it later.

azrael wrote:I've an idea for a (relatively) minor (I think), tweak to the way Chaos CTF works that would encourage a bit more teamplay:

Cool. Always gonna wanna hear those.

First off, make the flag drop button drop them one at a time, starting with your flag if you have it.

Already done. Except it's enemy flag first press of button, your own flag with 2nd press.

Second, make the default winning score 3 'captures'.
Then, alter the way points are scored -
one cap if you deliver both flags simultaneously,
two capture points if you only deliver the enemy flag, whilst yours is in the holder.

Well, I think 3 is a bit low for default, but IMO the default score isn't really a big deal. But the next part, well, I don't really care for that, for the same reason you mentioned later in the post. All I gotta do is throw one to a teammate first, and then we get 2 points instead of 1.

Optional extras include: making the return of your own flag worth a few frags, or a medal;

I like this. Wasn't sure if we do it by pts, or by adrenaline, or whatever, but yeah, it should be something.

only dropping the enemy flag when you grapple/translocate; being able to carry your own flag in any vehicle.

As I mentioned, you can still drop enemy flag with the DropFlag key. And you will always drop both flags at once when you translocate or grapple. But you also have a server side option of allowing grapple use with the flags. (which is my favorite way to play)

For the moment, I believe we will stick with Epic's default rules, where you cannot carry flags in any flying vehicles. The one vehicle that this issue remains in question, is the Hoverboard. Just to be frank with you, I do not want flag carrying on hoverboards, but LoQtUS does (just to give you two examples from the team, obviously others have opinions too). So atm, I'm not sure what's gonna end up happening. We haven't had time to mess with the hoverboard recently.

All of the above force teamwork by making it easier to win if your base has been properly defended (they haven't taken your flag) or no-one's been a flag hogger (despite how cool it looks to have crossed flags on your back and a dirty great sword in your fist).

I dunno man. I don't want to penalize somebody for having both flags. Sometimes that's gonna be what's required. And I think that it's always gonna be easier to win if you prevent them from taking your flag, no matter which option we discuss from above.

Hoverboard:But how about jumping onto a hoverboard whilst another drives it?impossible to fight against,so i think loqtus idea is better
Flag return award:imo 12 adren and 2 frag would be nice

Flagg,

[rant]I see what you're getting at; the status quo is pretty cool, with the twinflag tweaks and all the new toys, but I still think it needs to go further - theres bound to be a whole bunch of teenygamer morons out there who are gonna look at chaos, go "naah, same ol' same ol'" and leave without ever knowing what the game should always have been. What you need is a bunch of subtle, yet radical, touches that you can point to and tell them to shut up when they slag you off for running/playing chaos.[/rant]

All that aside, I am slightly concerned that you objected so to the kind of gameplay changes that I was trying to encourage in the first place.
Most of my suggestions are designed to exploit the fact that, under chaos, you can now have both flags in play to create new team tactics, and to encourage same by rewarding the team that brings the flags in separately.
As for the 'last second handoff', technically that too is teamplay, and there are ways to discourage it (like having a radius around the flag base where you can't drop either flag voluntarily), but there are some players out there who won't even go that far to help their team.

Well,there always IS a flag defender in the flag room,and i havent met one who wouldnt cap the flag if its dropped,and actually you can just

Go near flag,press drop flag once,go a bit backward,press drop once,pick and deliver for more points

I think Chaos CTF could become a very interesting tactical game if we added more strategic defensive things. We already have a bunch (laser mines, proxy mines, turrets), but more variety probably wouldn't hurt.

For instance, perhaps there could be a link turret that automatically detects and fires at friendly vehicles to heal them, or players who have link guns, to give them a boost while they are in range. Deployable alarms would be cool too. Set one up in a hallway outside the flag room and the defenders would always know when an enemy is about to enter the room. We could even make a little flag retrieval bot that you can pick up and throw when your flag is dropped. It will navigate to the flag, pick it up and try to bring it back to your base, it would pretty useful in some unusual ways.

Of course, maps that specifically encourage tactical gameplay are also a plus.

now that sounds sweet

maybe there could be some invulnerable bots roaming around(spawned randomly),and when they get ahold of a flag the invulnerability turns off and they zip away to return the flag,it would make people avoid dumping flags for others to get becouse a bot might zip in and return it