some random suggestions
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FurrySound
- Posts: 3098
- Joined: Fri May 17, 2002 4:37 pm
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I'm now thinking there should be some incentive to become the "ball" in my idea other then taking one for the team. Most players would probably just let the other team be the "ball" and use them to decrease their enemies score.
I can't for the life of me think up something good about being the "ball", I've got to think up a better term for that person, that wouldn't unbalance the invunerability of the sphere. If the.. oh lets call that person.. the scerb.. Yeah.. Scerb ball. Anyway, if the scerb if able to use weapons then he could just propel himself into the goal, which defeats the purpose. In my mind anyway.
So.. Maybe, a team based additive.. Like, the scerb can heal teammates. Thats not too bad. Can a health dispensing gun/tool be made though? Or maybe the scerb is a source of adrenaline for his teammates, letting them decide how they want to use the bonus of having the scerb on their side. They are after all technically losing a teammate..
I've just been thinking and typing at the same time, if you can understand any of that.. Cool. ^_^
I can't for the life of me think up something good about being the "ball", I've got to think up a better term for that person, that wouldn't unbalance the invunerability of the sphere. If the.. oh lets call that person.. the scerb.. Yeah.. Scerb ball. Anyway, if the scerb if able to use weapons then he could just propel himself into the goal, which defeats the purpose. In my mind anyway.
So.. Maybe, a team based additive.. Like, the scerb can heal teammates. Thats not too bad. Can a health dispensing gun/tool be made though? Or maybe the scerb is a source of adrenaline for his teammates, letting them decide how they want to use the bonus of having the scerb on their side. They are after all technically losing a teammate..
I've just been thinking and typing at the same time, if you can understand any of that.. Cool. ^_^
~Knives~
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FurrySound
- Posts: 3098
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Maybe you get additional points for being the ball when its scored.. that's once incentive.. The other could be maybe you can increase the radius of the protected area to encompase the player moving you for like 1 second every 10 seconds or so... so you can help defend the carrier... and yes, I'm thinking as I'm typing... or typing first and thinking later...
FurrySound{TOC}
-The sun never sets on the Chaotic Dreams Empire
-The sun never sets on the Chaotic Dreams Empire
How about this:
The ball(carrier) person is immune to all attacks, and each weapon impact will have a pushing effect on the ball based on location and direction of impact. The ball has realistic physics, if a tad bouncy. The ball(carrier) slowly looses health, and has [edit] only [/edit] a linkgun like tool that pulls toward a linked (by ballcarrier, not outside player) teamate and can push away from a linked enemy (with a constant force--the longer it's used the more speed is created). (Note: this tool link can be done to any player regardless of weapon they're carrying. The only link gun reference is to the interface and how it'd look to be have a pull or push beam) Using this tool drains the ballcarrier health faster. When the ball carrier runs out of health, the ball is in only receptive to the opposing team for a number of seconds (to be set by a menu?), after which any player may enter it. Whenever the occupied ball is touched, that player is fragged (this way people don't try to physically push the ball). The goal is a hole in the floor. The playing feild shuold be flat and, if sloped, only be slightly and rarely so.
Being the offense you must work as a team having a point man ahead of the ball so the ball has something to pull on, while the other teammates try to be sure the point man stays around long enough for a good pull. Being the ball you must decide when to pull on a friendly, and when to push off an enemy, and when not to fire to conserve health. Being defense, you must try to prevent the offense from securing a good point man position, and avoid getting in position such that the ball can get a helpful push of of you. If the player in the ball happens to roll over health, the carriers health will increase as usual. Ball carriers loose 5 adrenaline from entering the ball, and cannot increase adrenaline while in the ball (to prevent health booster from overly prolonging ball time).
Perhaps reward the pointman by making him invulnearable or less vulnerable while being pulled on. Maybe have a slider for how fast the health deteriorates when ball is not using tool and also when ball is using the tool. Maybe even a slider for how much pull/push force the tool has. Maybe even a slider for viscosity, setting it to 0 would be like the ball being like an air-hockey puck.
Just my thoughts for how to make this idea entertaining and balanced for the ballcarrier, the offense, and the defense.
The ball(carrier) person is immune to all attacks, and each weapon impact will have a pushing effect on the ball based on location and direction of impact. The ball has realistic physics, if a tad bouncy. The ball(carrier) slowly looses health, and has [edit] only [/edit] a linkgun like tool that pulls toward a linked (by ballcarrier, not outside player) teamate and can push away from a linked enemy (with a constant force--the longer it's used the more speed is created). (Note: this tool link can be done to any player regardless of weapon they're carrying. The only link gun reference is to the interface and how it'd look to be have a pull or push beam) Using this tool drains the ballcarrier health faster. When the ball carrier runs out of health, the ball is in only receptive to the opposing team for a number of seconds (to be set by a menu?), after which any player may enter it. Whenever the occupied ball is touched, that player is fragged (this way people don't try to physically push the ball). The goal is a hole in the floor. The playing feild shuold be flat and, if sloped, only be slightly and rarely so.
Being the offense you must work as a team having a point man ahead of the ball so the ball has something to pull on, while the other teammates try to be sure the point man stays around long enough for a good pull. Being the ball you must decide when to pull on a friendly, and when to push off an enemy, and when not to fire to conserve health. Being defense, you must try to prevent the offense from securing a good point man position, and avoid getting in position such that the ball can get a helpful push of of you. If the player in the ball happens to roll over health, the carriers health will increase as usual. Ball carriers loose 5 adrenaline from entering the ball, and cannot increase adrenaline while in the ball (to prevent health booster from overly prolonging ball time).
Perhaps reward the pointman by making him invulnearable or less vulnerable while being pulled on. Maybe have a slider for how fast the health deteriorates when ball is not using tool and also when ball is using the tool. Maybe even a slider for how much pull/push force the tool has. Maybe even a slider for viscosity, setting it to 0 would be like the ball being like an air-hockey puck.
Just my thoughts for how to make this idea entertaining and balanced for the ballcarrier, the offense, and the defense.
Last edited by Penfold on Thu Jul 10, 2003 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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thegreywolfe
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Thu May 08, 2003 5:46 pm
- Location: Los Angeles
Chaos Bombing Run
very cool. I was gonna say if you want to make people want the ball for their team. Give them 2 points if they score with their team member in, and 1 if it's the opposing teams ball.
I definately like the idea of a linkgun/tractor beam for the man in the ball, but you do need a way of killing the man in the ball. Does anyone remember the old UT game type Deathball. You had access to all the weapons on the map and each one could be used to move the ball. Give the man in the ball just the link gun and everyone else fun stuff. Use the vortex launcher to pull it along or even force it to go around corners. You could drag it with the grappling hooks. Be rather entertaining when you have a tug of war. I think the crossbow should shoot through it.
One more thing, you could always let the player in the ball walk around like he's in a hamster ball.
very cool. I was gonna say if you want to make people want the ball for their team. Give them 2 points if they score with their team member in, and 1 if it's the opposing teams ball.
I definately like the idea of a linkgun/tractor beam for the man in the ball, but you do need a way of killing the man in the ball. Does anyone remember the old UT game type Deathball. You had access to all the weapons on the map and each one could be used to move the ball. Give the man in the ball just the link gun and everyone else fun stuff. Use the vortex launcher to pull it along or even force it to go around corners. You could drag it with the grappling hooks. Be rather entertaining when you have a tug of war. I think the crossbow should shoot through it.
One more thing, you could always let the player in the ball walk around like he's in a hamster ball.
If you're not having fun, it's because I shot you in the head.
Well, I was going for more of a pinpall aspect. The fire of all parties would move the ball while they fought amongst each other to get rid of other influences on the ball's movement. The idea came about because I noticed that, with the curved structure of the maps now-a-days some interetsing things could be done with a ball physics system.
Now that I think of it, there is a use key though it's never.. well, used. So not only could there be player interaction with the ball, there could be a system of bumpers that could be player activated and/or jump pads that they could turn on at oppertune times. If the goal was above a certain cliff, a jump pad could be there so that not only would they have to get the ball onto the jump pad, then they'd have to hit it in midair to get it onto the ledge.
Now that I think of it, there is a use key though it's never.. well, used. So not only could there be player interaction with the ball, there could be a system of bumpers that could be player activated and/or jump pads that they could turn on at oppertune times. If the goal was above a certain cliff, a jump pad could be there so that not only would they have to get the ball onto the jump pad, then they'd have to hit it in midair to get it onto the ledge.
~Knives~
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Shadowstar
- Chaotic Dreams Team
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Here's a wild idea, and relatively simple: we wait until the melee system is coded into the game and either use the existing chaos weapons (sword, axe) or create a new "chaos club", which is like a golf club, but looks much meaner. Players then have to use the melee combat moves with the club to whack the ball around the map and into the enemy's goal. We can use the same BR maps that are already there, but the ball's physics should be changed so that it is much more bouncy and rolls more. Also, players can't pick up the ball. They can kick it with the chaos kick, but it won't move nearly as far as with a good solid whack from the chaos golf club, but maybe a good way to cut the momentum of the ball in case it's rolling too fast. If the ball is moving at a certain velocity and hits someone, it does damage, so you can bean enemy goal defenders out of the way by hitting the ball into them. The ball will bounce off players, so even though you can't pick up the ball, you can still block it when its flying, and even get it rolling by running into it if it's sitting still. Of course, the best way to move the ball will be with the club.
And the best part is, you can use the club to beat the snot out of your enemies!
Imagine: **WHACK** HEADSHOT!!
We could even consider the possibility of adding an offhand shield gun (or an actual shield with a chaos skull on it), which would use the club's alt fire to hold it in front of you, allowing you to block enemy clubbers or deflect an incoming ball (would be great for goal defenders).
It wouldn't require a huge revamp of the game rules, really just the addition of a new weapon/tool and a modification of the ball's physics. All existing BR maps would still be valid even. Plus it would make great use of the new melee system we will be adding in. If I understand it right, it will use different moves and the weapon hitscan will be path-based like in Jedi Knight 2, allowing for a wide variety of melee combat styles. That would play perfectly in a BR setting. You could perfect your "golf" swing, so that you can not only hit the ball farther, but also take your enemy's head with it.... hehhehehe
And the best part is, you can use the club to beat the snot out of your enemies!
Imagine: **WHACK** HEADSHOT!!
We could even consider the possibility of adding an offhand shield gun (or an actual shield with a chaos skull on it), which would use the club's alt fire to hold it in front of you, allowing you to block enemy clubbers or deflect an incoming ball (would be great for goal defenders).
It wouldn't require a huge revamp of the game rules, really just the addition of a new weapon/tool and a modification of the ball's physics. All existing BR maps would still be valid even. Plus it would make great use of the new melee system we will be adding in. If I understand it right, it will use different moves and the weapon hitscan will be path-based like in Jedi Knight 2, allowing for a wide variety of melee combat styles. That would play perfectly in a BR setting. You could perfect your "golf" swing, so that you can not only hit the ball farther, but also take your enemy's head with it.... hehhehehe
If the ball is going to envolop the player, and have primary movement by weapon projectile impact, than you cannot have the person inside it vulnerable from external attack. The ball is the primary thing to be hit with weapons, and if the player inside get's hurt without the ability to dodge out of the way, no one will want to be inside the ball.
Hence, the player slowly loosing health. And to prevent overuse of the pull/push beam, health will drain faster with its use. So, if you want the person out of the ball, you'd need to go about it indirectly. Either by pushing it away with weapon fire and hoping the person overuses the push/pull beam and runs out of health, or if the ballcarrier doesn't, just be glad he's that much closer to where you want the ball. I think if there is going to be a point bonus dependant upon who's in the ball, it be should extra points if your enemy is in the ball when you score.
You could also have the delay which rejects same team ball re-entry be part of a funtion on how close the ball is from the previous carriers goal-target relative to their goal. There could also be a short time period when no-one is allowed in the ball, where players try to stay close enough to get in quick when the ball is 'open' but not too close, as touching it frags them.
I also like the pinball like suggestion of having bumpers. As in powered bumpers (as every wall would be bumpable). Depending upon where the bumpers push to, these might have battles nearly as intense as those close to the goal... But, IMHO, you can't have the ball person able to attack, as he's invulnerable and this would throw off balance, but at the same time, that person needs the pull/push beam to make it so that (1) the team that owns the ball matters and (2) people will want to actually enter the ball.
Done right, this could actually be a very entertaining game type. And as the floorplan would be essentially flat, even newby mappers might be able to make decent maps for the gametype.
Hence, the player slowly loosing health. And to prevent overuse of the pull/push beam, health will drain faster with its use. So, if you want the person out of the ball, you'd need to go about it indirectly. Either by pushing it away with weapon fire and hoping the person overuses the push/pull beam and runs out of health, or if the ballcarrier doesn't, just be glad he's that much closer to where you want the ball. I think if there is going to be a point bonus dependant upon who's in the ball, it be should extra points if your enemy is in the ball when you score.
You could also have the delay which rejects same team ball re-entry be part of a funtion on how close the ball is from the previous carriers goal-target relative to their goal. There could also be a short time period when no-one is allowed in the ball, where players try to stay close enough to get in quick when the ball is 'open' but not too close, as touching it frags them.
I also like the pinball like suggestion of having bumpers. As in powered bumpers (as every wall would be bumpable). Depending upon where the bumpers push to, these might have battles nearly as intense as those close to the goal... But, IMHO, you can't have the ball person able to attack, as he's invulnerable and this would throw off balance, but at the same time, that person needs the pull/push beam to make it so that (1) the team that owns the ball matters and (2) people will want to actually enter the ball.
Done right, this could actually be a very entertaining game type. And as the floorplan would be essentially flat, even newby mappers might be able to make decent maps for the gametype.
See, the idea came about because we were discussing the invunerability sheild in Q3. The "ball" would act as an invunerability sheild, keeping that player safe from the weapons fire that would move the ball around the map.
Though I have to say, I like the club idea too. With that idea, we don't need the player inside the ball. The ball should be about half the player model size, so one can see over it to where they're aiming, but at the same time see the ball itself and hit it while looking straight ahead.
Also, that idea wouldn't require all new maps, though it would be very hard to play on a couple of the existing ones. I can imagine someone trying to score in BR-Anubis and never succeding.
Both game types would require more team work then the original BR, which is something I like about them.
Though I have to say, I like the club idea too. With that idea, we don't need the player inside the ball. The ball should be about half the player model size, so one can see over it to where they're aiming, but at the same time see the ball itself and hit it while looking straight ahead.
Also, that idea wouldn't require all new maps, though it would be very hard to play on a couple of the existing ones. I can imagine someone trying to score in BR-Anubis and never succeding.
Both game types would require more team work then the original BR, which is something I like about them.
~Knives~
Yes, I know. But I was trying to think of a way that this could be a team sport that (1) a person would actually want to be in the ball. (2) the person in the ball wouldn't be overly powerful (ie, takes no damage while giving plenty) (3) the person in the ball would have something to do, and (4) would be fun to play.Knives wrote:See, the idea came about because we were discussing the invunerability sheild in Q3. The "ball" would act as an invunerability sheild, keeping that player safe from the weapons fire that would move the ball around the map.
If you want a single player invicible ball, how about this:
have a key bound to deactivate ball. When you get adrenaline and activate the ball you take half damage (or some menu scalable ammount). Also, there is a couple seconds (slider adjustable) delay between when you press the deactivation and when the ball actually deactivates. Now, if you deactivate the ball, and don't run out of health by the time the ball actually deactivates, then you regain your original health and sheild as when you activated the ball. If you run out of health with the ball, the ball colapses opon itself and you're fragged. The ball should also drain health as a way to automatically limit it's time and add some more risk to throw some balance back into the equation.
Now, the health dropping you can just chalk up to the HUD being updated for warning of how close to collapse the ball is, and say that the health of the player doesn't degrade at all, unless of course the ball collapses which leads to the ball person getting fragged.
This way a person is vulnerable. If you lay it on fast and quick, the player might not have enough time to deactivate the ball in time, and get fragged. But if he/she plays it right, he can also be seen as invulnerable. At the same time, the sheilded person can't just run past 10 people unloading on him/her.
As long as the person doesn't put him/herself in a bad position and knows when to deactivate, they're invulnerable.
Also, if the adrenaline runs out before the person has the ball deactivated, it also leads to an unstable collapse and thus a frag.
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Swift Viper
- Posts: 160
- Joined: Sun Aug 25, 2002 12:17 am
I'm a idea freak and seeing new types of weapons is nice, not the same old weapons we saw 1000's of times before. It only seems like sometimes people try nice ideas, like the Flak Cannon or Shock Rifle. Why can't we see more of this? I guess another hard part is coming up with new ideas that WORK. Rather then the powerful bullet/beam/etc. that a Sinper Rifle shoots, what about a Link Beam style shot, having to keep your aim on the target to snipe them? What about a minigun flame-thrower? Normal fire works like UT's Minigun normal fire while alt fire is the flame-thrower steam. And speaking of flame-throwers, how come a lot of them have the same alt fire, the fireball? I already have lots of ideas for weapons, but I don't know how to program to make them, only know how to mess around with the code a little and not actually make new code. I'll have to learn :read: , somehow. Why does it feel like people are not trying new ideas a lot and are just using the same old ones that "work"?Shadowstar wrote:Coming up with original ideas isn't something you can try to do, it just happens. The more you force it, the less likely it will happen. The best thing to do is just have fun and the ideas will come by themselves.
BTW, will there be a Utility Gun or another gun that pushes people around in Beta 2? It was fun pushing people around in ChaosUT.
As for the ball, have to reread it and post again later and once again, I'm a idea freak, seems like ideas comes to me out of nowhere.
Mad Member with lots of ideas and questions and somewhat good fragging skills.
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thegreywolfe
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Thu May 08, 2003 5:46 pm
- Location: Los Angeles
Okay, I think this is a new idea. It'd be lot's of fun with Chaos.
V.1
Flag Fortress
Minimum suggested 3 players per team
Spawn Items:
Flag Holder
Fortress
Weapon Emplacement
Play occurs on large size maps with varying surfaces (primarily outdoors). Each map will include team-spawning stations where each team will start the map. When the match begins each player appears in the spawn station and picks up the spawn item they will carry. Should there be less than 3 players, a player may make multiple trips to pick up spawn items. Each team will have one minute to find a location for their base and carry the spawn items to be placed.
V.2
Change Name to Defend the Fort
Spawn Items
Fortress
Weapon Emplacement
Redesign maps to include a wall to come down after 30 seconds between the two team areas.
At 45 seconds to 1 minute, set bomb for each team in base.
Objective changes to bring the bomb and place (or throw) it into the power chamber for each fort. Forts can be mesh objects, such as small towers, houses and downed spaceships. Either make fort rise from ground or fall from sky. Only bomb can destroy a fort. If bomb is on ground for more than 5 seconds have it blow in small nuclear explosion, but not destroy nearby fort in blast radius. If enemy touches bomb, it deactivates and reappears in holder in home fort.
V.1
Flag Fortress
Minimum suggested 3 players per team
Spawn Items:
Flag Holder
Fortress
Weapon Emplacement
Play occurs on large size maps with varying surfaces (primarily outdoors). Each map will include team-spawning stations where each team will start the map. When the match begins each player appears in the spawn station and picks up the spawn item they will carry. Should there be less than 3 players, a player may make multiple trips to pick up spawn items. Each team will have one minute to find a location for their base and carry the spawn items to be placed.
V.2
Change Name to Defend the Fort
Spawn Items
Fortress
Weapon Emplacement
Redesign maps to include a wall to come down after 30 seconds between the two team areas.
At 45 seconds to 1 minute, set bomb for each team in base.
Objective changes to bring the bomb and place (or throw) it into the power chamber for each fort. Forts can be mesh objects, such as small towers, houses and downed spaceships. Either make fort rise from ground or fall from sky. Only bomb can destroy a fort. If bomb is on ground for more than 5 seconds have it blow in small nuclear explosion, but not destroy nearby fort in blast radius. If enemy touches bomb, it deactivates and reappears in holder in home fort.
If you're not having fun, it's because I shot you in the head.