some possible idea's and observations

WulfMan · Post by **WulfMan** » Sat Jul 19, 2003 7:04 pm

first off I just wanted to say I love this mod, I use it almost exclusively when playing UT2003 now.

however I've noticed a few things that might make the mod a little better in future releases.

1. you can't bind a quick button for the Chaos Rocket Launcher, and you can't add it like you can the other weapons using arena or switcharsenal mods. (I would love to be able to not have to scroll thru weapons to call up this one, and also it would be nice to be able to add it to other games using an arena or switch arsenal mutator.)

2. pipedswitchedweapons would be nice, so I can bind more than one weapon to a key, with all the new functions added to ChaosUT, I don't have enough buttons within reach to bind each weapon to a quick key, so I use pipedswitchedweapons binds to have faster access to each weapon. but with the new system for calling up Chaos weapons I can't find a way to do that.

3. the ammo changer is way too slow, weapons switching is crucial to playing successfully, and by the time I change ammo to the one I want for a weapon, I've already been shot ten times. the animation should cycle more quickly, and if possible, a way to configure a weapon for ammo types would be incredibly helpful, so we can order the starting ammo, and the order they cycle in for faster usage of preferred ammo types.

4. when using switcharsenal to add Chaos weapons to a normal game of UT2003, the only ammo type that's available for the weapon is the default ammo type (unless the map already has other ammo types IE: Chaos maps)

5. bot support for KotH mods. I've played several rounds and several maps of KotH with the bots, and they treat it like normal DM, they almost never go for the "hill" to score points, and on some of the maps (Dungeon) the bots will continually jump in one place trying to get to upper platforms without ever moving from that spot or attacking people.

these are my suggestions for improving the mod in future releases, although I do love it, I think it can still get better with some minor changes, the biggest being configurability.

I hope that the mod continues to thrive and I appreciate all the time and effort you've obviously put into this

Wulf

jeditobe1 · Post by **jeditobe1** » Sat Jul 19, 2003 7:24 pm

1. The hotfix should have helped with the Rocket Launcher
3. Each weapon changes ammo at different speeds. However part of the downside (in my opinion at least) to the more powerful ammo types is that if you run out you are stuck switching.
5. Its being worked on. Weve already had some new versions of two of the KOTH maps put up for testing.

Post by **R.Flagg** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 12:16 am

Thanks for the killer post WulfMan.

As Jedi said, #1 has been fixed in the HotFix patch. And #5 is being worked on.

The rest is stuff we'll look at, and then decide what we want to do, if anything.

But that's a healthy post. Thanks for your time.

Zachariah · Post by **Zachariah** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 12:32 am

has anything been done about that weird white/transparent box around the laserdot for the sniper/rocketlauncher?

Post by **R.Flagg** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 12:36 am

Yes sir. We believe it's been fixed for good.

WulfMan · Post by **WulfMan** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 3:16 am

no problem Flagg, I went thru and played some more today and I have a few more things I've noticed

most of these are minor things that maybe only I have problems with, but I'll mention them anyways in case others have noticed but haven't put their fingers on it yet.

1. Sniper Rifle and Rocket Launcher crosshairs are next to impossible to see at longer distances, especially during a fight, if possible, the option to use a default static crosshair for those weapons would be greatly appreciated.

2. When I'm in a heavy fight, I can only tell I've fired the crossbow once out of maybe 10 shots. the animation for firing coupled with the next to invisible arrow make it hard to tell if you're even firing off bolts. Either a more pronounced firing animation, or some sort of "tracer" on the arrow to be able to see it flying would really help in the chaotic battles.

3. again maybe it's just me, but when I score a hit with the sniper rifle I rarely see any indicators, sometimes the player model will stutter or jump, but most times I know my crosshair is on the person, and it should be a hit, but there's no way for me to tell. I have blood turned on, but I've never seen blood fly from the person being hit.

4. I noticed that the proximity mines (one of the coolest little creatures ever made for the game

) do have team indicators, but they're so small and they don't glow (or aren't very bright if they do) which makes it almost impossible to tell friendly mines from enemy mines until it's too late. possibly adding a glow, or maybe even colored team skins for them would help players in identifying potential threats.

as stated in my earlier post, I love this mod and will continue to use it, and the improvements from the hotfix are already improving how the mod plays. your hard work and dedication to the UT2003 community is greatly appreciated.

Wulf

jeditobe1 · Post by **jeditobe1** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 3:22 am

The crossbow arrows actually do have tracers, unfortunately there seems to be an issue for some people with seeing them online. Its a very thin airstream thats color coded to the arrow type.

The sniper rifle has a pretty big push... but not a really big blood fountain as i remember. However... if you hit someone dead on it will push them around quite a bit.

Get used to avoiding all proxies. If you step on your own they turn on you anyways. =)

WulfMan · Post by **WulfMan** » Sun Jul 20, 2003 8:10 pm

jeditobe1 wrote:The crossbow arrows actually do have tracers, unfortunately there seems to be an issue for some people with seeing them online. Its a very thin airstream thats color coded to the arrow type.

The sniper rifle has a pretty big push... but not a really big blood fountain as i remember. However... if you hit someone dead on it will push them around quite a bit.

Get used to avoiding all proxies. If you step on your own they turn on you anyways. =)

again these are issues I've noticed, for me the crossbow is not even worth using in heavy fighting, I can't tell if I've even shot an arrow, let alone hit someone, so for all I see, unless there's a death message I can't judge how well I'm doing with it. same thing with the sniper rifle, alot of weapons cause a push to the player, so in large fights with multiple people shooting, you can't tell who's caused what push.

as for the proxies, if you step on them or shoot at them they'll attack you, but if you know they're on your team, you can simply run by them without provoking your own.....as it is now I have to shoot at or completely avoid any proxies I see just in case they're aren't on my team, which defeats the purpose IMO

T-Bone7 · Post by **T-Bone7** » Mon Jul 21, 2003 2:33 am

The problem with arrow visibility is mostly the color and/or size of the tracer for the default ammo. Gray is very hard to see in most environments. Consider changing the color, please.

bitterman · Post by **bitterman** » Mon Jul 21, 2003 11:37 am

hmmm, i think it should be a server setting for proxies to attack teamates or not, if not than make a small glow visable only to the owners team that would make it better.

jb · Post by jb » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:11 pm

Thanks for the reply. I figures I should chime in to tell you some of the reasons for our choices we made:

4. I noticed that the proximity mines (one of the coolest little creatures ever made for the game ) do have team indicators, but they're so small and they don't glow (or aren't very bright if they do) which makes it almost impossible to tell friendly mines from enemy mines until it's too late. possibly adding a glow, or maybe even colored team skins for them would help players in identifying potential threats.

The proxies do have team color skins and the do glow a red or a blue color in team games. Use the alt zoom mode of the Sniper and that will tell you at a safe distance a "friendly" proxy from a "mean" proxy.

1. Sniper Rifle and Rocket Launcher crosshairs are next to impossible to see at longer distances, especially during a fight, if possible, the option to use a default static crosshair for those weapons would be greatly appreciated.

Pretty sure we are going to add this back as a client side option.

2. When I'm in a heavy fight, I can only tell I've fired the crossbow once out of maybe 10 shots. the animation for firing coupled with the next to invisible arrow make it hard to tell if you're even firing off bolts. Either a more pronounced firing animation, or some sort of "tracer" on the arrow to be able to see it flying would really help in the chaotic battles.

We can see about maybe extending the current tracers a bit more. Or something to help. However we don't want to make this is easy as a rocket to see. I feel that some of the balance of this weapon is that the arrows are harder to see.

3. the ammo changer is way too slow, weapons switching is crucial to playing successfully, and by the time I change ammo to the one I want for a weapon, I've already been shot ten times. the animation should cycle more quickly, and if possible, a way to configure a weapon for ammo types would be incredibly helpful, so we can order the starting ammo, and the order they cycle in for faster usage of preferred ammo types.

All ammo changes should last 2 seconds. I know 2 seconds is a long time in a fire fight. But 2 seconds is probably about how fast in real life it would take you to pull out one clip, slap in another one and get the gun ready to fire again. Plus it makes you think a bit more...hey I dont want to be caught in the middle of this channing ammo so I better do it know before I charge

4. when using switcharsenal to add Chaos weapons to a normal game of UT2003, the only ammo type that's available for the weapon is the default ammo type (unless the map already has other ammo types IE: Chaos maps)

Yeap same thing happens when you play an arena mut with our weapons. We have to find a way to add to this...

. bot support for KotH mods. I've played several rounds and several maps of KotH with the bots, and they treat it like normal DM, they almost never go for the "hill" to score points, and on some of the maps (Dungeon) the bots will continually jump in one place trying to get to upper platforms without ever moving from that spot or attacking people.

Both MistyValley and SwampTemple have been tweeked. Bots now play this one better.

Thanks again for your input and please feel free to add more.

WulfMan · Post by **WulfMan** » Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:08 pm

All ammo changes should last 2 seconds. I know 2 seconds is a long time in a fire fight. But 2 seconds is probably about how fast in real life it would take you to pull out one clip, slap in another one and get the gun ready to fire again. Plus it makes you think a bit more...hey I dont want to be caught in the middle of this channing ammo so I better do it know before I charge

if it were just a two second delay it wouldn't be a problem, but lets say for example, the grenade launcher. I'm in a fire fight, and my trusty rocketlauncher runs out of ammo, or I'm having trouble seeing the crosshair

. I hit my quick bind to call up the grenade launcher and I desperately need my napalm grenades to stop a swarm of incoming enemies. Here's where the problem comes in..... first I switch to the grenade launcher and lose a second, then I notice my grenade launcher has regular explosive ammo which doesn't have a large splash radius and will be useless......so I switch ammo, and lose another second or two, and I see phospherescent grenades......Eeek, now I have to switch again and lose another second or two.

if you only had to switch ammo once, the two second delay you mentioned would be fine, but when you have to cycle thru up to 4 ammo types, you're potentially losing alot more than just 1 or 2 seconds, not to mention you have to keep your attention on what ammo type is cycling so you don't go by the one you need accidentaly and have to start the cycle over again.

I realize you can't make ammo changing too fast or it becomes too easy again, but could you possibly speed up the ammo changes on the weapons that use more than two ammo types? or if nothing else, let us config these weapons in an ini or in the GUI so that I can specify, when I call up the grenade launcher, I want napalm ammo first (if I have it of course), then poisen, then explosive, then phospherescent last, so I don't have to wonder what ammo I'm going to have, and when I'll get to it.

as for the rest of my suggestions, I appreciate the answers, I never thought of using the scope to see the proxies better, although that's only handy when you're alone and had more time to look closely at the their team skins anyways

I hope my suggestions aren't being seen as nitpicky, and if they are I apologize, I'm just wanting to be able to use your weapons and gametypes to their fullest.

Wulf

jeditobe1 · Post by **jeditobe1** » Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:31 pm

You dont have to wait for one ammo change animation to finish before you can switch again. Just quickly tap the switchammo button and you can cycle through until it displays the "Selected Napalm Ammo" This means you would only have one two second reload and less than a second of tapping.

Also, you can preload ammo and switch to a different weapon

jb · Post by jb » Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:51 pm

Wulf,

hmmm that is a good point and we can look into it to make maybe a better way. Also nothing is too nit picky so please keep posting. The only way we can make Chaos better is with feedback... Just keep in mind that we have reasons for some of the design choices we made

Zachariah · Post by **Zachariah** » Mon Jul 21, 2003 5:01 pm

wulf maybe you havnt noticed this but theres a little icon of the ammo you currently have selected in the bottom right corner , right next to the ammo indicator , all you have to do is glance to that to see what ammo your switching to , you don't have to wait for the animations to finish or look at the gun to see what ammo you have/are getting .

but maybe you chaos guys should add some more icons , say where the grenades are shown with the assault rifle , to display all the different ammotypes , and how much of each , that a player has for the current gun , i dont have time problems switching , but sometimes ill whip out my launcher , fire off 1 regulargrenade then accidently launch 2or3 flashes , and get myself killed cuz i thought i had napalms.