Weapon summon names?

Nemephosis · Post by **Nemephosis** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 6:13 pm

Okay I can understand the non-holdable multiple arrows but would you consider making the windlass-using fire mode hold it until you're ready? It would only be one arrow and you need to be an excellent shot.

I have an idea for the CAS12 but I think I'll wait till you decide whether it's going in or not.

jb · Post by jb » Tue Jul 22, 2003 6:38 pm

We might....however thats in the same case. An arrow fully charged at point blank is near deadly (dont have the code in front of me atm so I dont know exactly how much damage it does fully charged but i know is a lot more than a normal arrow).

So whats your idea for the CAS12?

Nemephosis · Post by **Nemephosis** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 6:55 pm

Use the Weapon Mode switch button tochange the shotgun into a machine gun. However you'd still only have a the same clip size.

Like if you could only load 10 explosive shotgun shells, you'd have 10-round explosive machine gun clips.

Just a thought I guess.

edit: just to clear up possible confusion, it would be single-round shots, not a shotgun that fires at machinegun speed. That would be maybe too much for ChaosUT2K3.

Post by **Shadowstar** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 11:55 pm

I'd like to say that the CUTTER should NOT be changed in the slightest. The alt-fire shards are already very powerful, try walking through just a few and you will see what I mean. They are different from what you might be used to, but very effective. Instead of thinking of it as a radius effect, think of it more along the lines of the individual shards. They each do thier own damage. So, if you can land the shot in a place that will direct the shards in the same general direction (like a corner) you can seriously wound or even kill someone if most of the shards hit them.

Of course, the best way to use it is indirectly. Shoot some into a crowded room (preferably onto the cieling or the floor near the targets), and then fire a few primary fire blades in to finish off the survivors.

The cutter is a very powerful weapon, it should not be made more powerful.

On another note, I'm all for adding in the CAS12 shotgun. We could put it alongside another weapon like the claw2 or crossbow.

Nemephosis · Post by **Nemephosis** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 2:14 am

Well we need more shards or make the hit radius bigger or something cause right now it's just way too hard to hit with the shards. They do good damage.... if you can manage to connect with them. It's next to impossible.

Of course that's just one guys opinion who doesn't eben work on the team.

Post by **Shadowstar** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:22 am

Well, possibly there could be some way to allow the player to "direct" the shards.

For instance, using real physics, the blade would break up in the direction of its movement, unless it smacked clean against a surface at a right angle, so for instance, if the blade hit the ground at a shallow angle, the fragments should spray out over the ground in that direction. This would be a deadly way of taking someone's legs off or at least lacerating them badly.

Right now, no matter what the angle the blade hits at, the shards fly off in random directions. This isn't as realistic and the main reason the alt fire doesn't seem to do that much damage.

However, my main worry here is that by doing this, the cutter would become capable of a kill with a single alt-fire shot. As powerful as the sniper rifle, even.

Perhaps as a way to balance this, if the blade hits a person dead on, it won't break up, but rather act as a primary fire shot and stick in. This is realistic as well, since there's no real reason for the alt-fire shot to behave any differently when impacting a person as it would in primary fire mode. Flesh is flesh, it should stick in the same no matter what the angle of impact is. This would prevent the blade from breaking up and basically sending all of the fragments into the same player, thus doing extreme damage.

I also think the damage of the shards should be scaled according to thier velocity. A slow moving shard would have almost no puncturing power, and would most likely be deflected by the player's armor. A fast moving shard would rip through the armor and cause a fair amount of damage. This also provides incentive for players using alt-fire to impact the blades at an angle which best promotes fragment velocity, thus increasing the overall damage potential of the shot. This encourages skill, and will seperate the newbies from the skilled players, as the skilled players would know what angles of impact work the best to achieve maximum shard effectiveness. Perhaps we could modify the blade's muzzle velocity by the player's velocity, allowing a player who's running to produce faster moving blades by running in the direction they are firing in. If you were moving away from your shot direction, the blade would be slower. Strafing might cause the blade to drift to a side slightly. Then again, this might be too much.

Of course, if we really want realism, we can apply torque physics to the blades, and have them curve in flight due to thier spinning motion. If you've ever flown a helicopter, you'll know what I'm talking about. That would really make the CUTTER a weapon of skill.

jb · Post by jb » Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:58 am

Rob,

the alt fire blades are spining at x2 the rate of the single fire. Thus they force the blade on the edge of stability and thus shatter when they hit any object...or so thats was my thinking....

Post by **R.Flagg** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 2:25 pm

Nemephosis wrote:Of course that's just one guys opinion who doesn't eben work on the team.

Hay, that's great though. We want your opinion on the whole mod, if you've got time to write it up. (all I personally hope is that folks spend some time before forming a 'final' opinion. Some things take time to see, or see clearly)

But, hehe, having said that, I tend to agree with our Man Behind the Sounds here, and say that IMO, the CUTTER is fine, if not maybe even a touch too powerful. I'm getting sprees with that thing on a regular basis, and taking off my own head as much as anybody else's.

But we all have an opinion, and that's all. Despite they way some speak of this stuff (and will be speaking of this), it's not an exact science. There is no certain magic number of hit points or ROF where if we hit it, we made the mod 'right', or 'balanced', and if we're off by +/- 5 or whatever, we goofed.

All we can do is play, and play, and listen to what folks are saying. And play.

So, thanks for playing, and saying what you thought. Please continue.

FurrySound · Post by **FurrySound** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 3:58 pm

you forgot to mention .. and play..

I've found that with a little practice and some leading the target, the Alt-fire is pretty lethal.

Post by **Shadowstar** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 6:43 pm

That's true. If you can get someone to run through the "cloud" of shards right after impact, most of them will hit and do lots of damage.

Maybe the CUTTER isn't too powerful. When we get melee weapons in, the shots will (I assume) be deflectable. That could quickly turn it against the shooter. Imagine if you could block a cutter blade and cause it to take off the head of the guy who shot at you?

I would advise against any tweaking, and let's see how it works out after the next public release. There will be lots of new things in by then.

FurrySound · Post by **FurrySound** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 6:59 pm

I don't think you should be able to reflect the cutter blade straight back, but deflect it sure, and then if it bounces and hits the attacker... well.. he shoulda moved

I agree... don't touch it.

Nemephosis · Post by **Nemephosis** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:52 pm

A sword and shield would be a neat addition... primary swings the sword, secondary raises a shield. U4E Fortress had a great shield that protected you from everything except hard, head on damage like rockets. If they didn't hit you, the splash damage would be blocked.

Last I heard MaxSMoke's gone off to make his own retail game, so I guess taking the Katana wouldn't hurt would it?

(I mean without the teleporting around like it did)

Nemephosis · Post by **Nemephosis** » Thu Jul 24, 2003 12:02 pm

*bump*

Ice Arrows for the Crossbow that freeze someone and halve speed by 50% or so?

jb · Post by jb » Thu Jul 24, 2003 12:04 pm

hmmm not a bad idea at all.

FurrySound · Post by **FurrySound** » Thu Jul 24, 2003 3:01 pm

Although we should decide which weapon.. xbow has 4 ammo types already... what about the UG or its next generation with ice and fire? Maybe save the ice for that instead?

Although if you could load one of each ammo type into the xbow and then fire all 5 in one shot (multi-arrow, multi-ammo)...